Diane Abbott...again.

#1
She’s spoken out against the police ramming tactic re mopeds.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7874607/moped-gangs-broken-bones-rammed-police-new-tactic/

Would she prefer the alternative.....For Gods sake, what is wrong with this f'g woman?

She must be who David Blunkett was referring to when he made reference to 'bleeding heart liberals'

She must be the left wing's answer to Katie Hopkins





And Didn’t she go round France on the back of Corbyn's bike?
 

PAD

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#2
What's wrong with her? I believe she is mentally ill. If the media were to regularly take advantage of a mentally ill member of your family and expose them to ridicule, how might you react? Join in the ’fun’?

I don’t know why action hasn’t been taken to put Abbott ‘out of harms way’ for the benefit of all, including her, and it doesn’t reflect well on the Labour Party. But I think the attention paid to her says more about scumbag journalists, newspaper organisations and media corporations than it does anyone or anything else.

Abbott’s disapproval of police tactics in relation to ‘moped crime’ is of little consequence really, isn’t it?:nusenuse:
 
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petey2sheds

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#3
I can't see how her & her do-goody cronies can disagree with this tactic when the figures suggest it has already reduced attacks by these scooter vermin by 33% over the few months since its introduction. I'm all for it :motorino::rocket:
 

mickvfr800fiw

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#4
It makes no odds what that silly woman says , Cassandra has support from other quarters of westminster and possibly a majority of the public although I can’t back that up .

From what I’ve seen over the past couple of weeks it looks very much like those riding high powered scooters ( not mopeds ) are very much in the cross hairs of the met .

I saw some of those police bikes who were tasked with tackling the problem actually caught 2 scooter riders on grays inn road on Wednesday . Seems that even plod have had enough now .
 
#5
I didn’t know the reduction had been by so much, so quickly.
To me that only suggests how well and truly the door must have been wide open before.

Trouble is now this crime pattern has been established as opposed to say just doing crystals down the park, now it has 'momentum ' it’s going to need somewhere else to vent.

So possibly to little to late as these perps now think the line is drawn somewhere else.
 

FTM

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#6
I'm one of the people who have slagged off Abbott in the past, something isn't right with her and I blamed alcohol but as PAD suggests it may be a mental illness.
I'm on the fence about ramming the scooter scum because I can see the police using these tactics against bikers who have merely committed motoring offences.
 

petey2sheds

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#7
According to the BBC radio reports there will definitely be some kind of campaign against, as ministers are concerned over a number of possible scenarios, one of which is little Joey Bloggs razzing off on his sisters scooter aged 12 for a joy ride simply because he can, & then getting creamed by Mr Plod in his X5. I can sort of see the angle on this one as youngsters nowadays are out of control & don't seem to be equipped with one iota of respect or common sense.:BangHead::cop1::dijono:
 
#8
Interesting point about us getting hit too.

They gave chase to a mate of mine 2 up on an RD250 in 1982.
He was riding without, tax, insurance, licence, Mot etc.
They chased him In a Range Rover all through the tunnels in Brum on to the Aston Expressway.
He was intent on getting back to the leafy seclusion of mom n dads when cops outgunned him on the straight and blocking his exit into Erdington forced him to the M6 northbound slip (very convenient for them as they’ve got their own private exit to motorway central at thornbridge avenue just half a mile further on along the hard shoulder)

He yielded and just before they came to a complete stop on the hard shoulder gave bike a decent punt and knocked both off to avoid them accelerating off again. Though in those days they used the V8 Range Rover so I doubt if a 250, 2 up would have been a problem,. But they bought them and the situation under their control decisively and quickly.

The point I’m getting round to making is, I recall in the 80s before litigation and accountability would have been a problem it wasn’t uncommon for the cops to give a biker a low speed shove.

Anyway, the cops got hold of him and gave him a good clip round the ear and took him back to mom n dad and he never did it again. (I made that last bit up :D )
 
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PAD

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#9
I must admit that one slight concern occurred to me. Could this tactic in some way legitimise, in the minds of a malevolent few, taking similar action towards motorcyclists on the basis of a perceived ‘transgression’, such as filtering? I’m sure most, if not all have encountered those who will deliberately block a filtering motorcyclist and it would be but a small step to make it a contact sport Yes, it would imply a degree of lunacy on their part, but they’d be in the good company of Ms Abbott - and plenty clearly pay attention to her batty opinions.
 

mickvfr800fiw

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#10
I can't see how her & her do-goody cronies can disagree with this tactic when the figures suggest it has already reduced attacks by these scooter vermin by 33% over the few months since its introduction. I'm all for it :motorino::rocket:
I agree with this tactic , it should have been used as soon as the problem became apparent .

I think the increase in the level of violence being used was probably the tipping point .

I also think the 33% figure maybe a bit misleading . This might account for only a small number of those committing similar crimes but those getting “rammed” may have been responsible for a very high volume of “ moped crime “ making up the 33% reduction in that particular crime if you see what I mean.

They’ve always used this method ( when it was necessary do do it ) despite what the media would have you believe and certain poster of this forum . The only difference now is it now seems to be the preferred method rather than the last resort. I’d like to see a break down in numbers for this 33% reduction to establish the numbers being rammed against how much crime they had committed
I'm on the fence about ramming the scooter scum because I can see the police using these tactics against bikers who have merely committed motoring offences.
If you choose not to stop then this might happen I suppose . So the answer is surely just to stop when you see police behind you who obviously want you to stop for them .
 

TC1474

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#12
As someone (along with a couple of others from the site) who have had to deal with similar situations in the past, any decision to pursue is not made lightly let alone any decision to knock someone off, but the circumstances and the decision have to be weighed against the risk to the public.

To use a Star Trek saying, "The needs of the many outwigh the needs of the few" and so the risk assessment has to be carried out quickly.

Many years ago we were involved in a chase involving a stolen car with 1 of 2 14 year lds driving. The pursuit had gone on for about 20 minutes and they had hit several other vehicles and injured a number of people. They were not going to stop.

Anyway, long story short, they entered the Motorway and we were able to close off one of the carriageways wich would force the bandit vehicle up the slip road where in the meantime my Sgt had commandeered an HGV put it across the top of the exit ramp meaning the car had to stop. Or so it was thought.

The car ploughed into the side of the HGV killing both occupants.

My Sgt was crucified by the press for allowing this tragedy to happen. But they completely ignored the injury and damage that these 2 scrotes had already caused and they ignored the fact that said scrotes had the opportunity to stop.

In another case, I was doing a speed check on a major road when a car (Renault 5 Turbo) came past at around 110 (we were on a dual carriageway) and completely ignored signs to stop, so me any my partner were on our bikes in pursuit going after him, bearing in mind we had no idea what the driver might have been up to.

Over the Motorway back down onto the single lane carriageway and the bandit went for a blind overtake on a left hand bend to be confronted by a van travelling in the opposite direction. I remember to this day seeing the drivers decpitated head fly past my right shoulder

The van driver was traumatised as there was nothing he could have done, but (and this was the key) in the boot of the car was a bag containg 2 sawn off shotguns and about £50,000 in cash.

20 minutes peviously the driver had carried out armed robberies at 2 post offices just outside our area.

The question was asked, what were we doing chasing him just because he was speeding? The fact that the driver was travelling so fast and failed to stop was ignored and once the circumstances of what he had done was released, the next phase of "Oh the poor driver did not deserve to die like that" kicked in. My view was that the driver again had the option to stop.

Not so much as an eyebrow was raised at the inquest.

On the bike we used to get involved in pursuits and people could not believe that we could sort of ram a car on the bike. It was not so much as ramming, more a case of if you had the right bit of road, as the vehicle went into a left hander you would sit on the rear right quarter, stick your boot out onto the bumper and wind the throttle open. This would in many cases cause oversteer and force the car into the ditch.

It used to be funny when it went to court and said scrotes would accuse a motorcyclist of ramming his car and forcing him to crash ;) The look on the Magistrates or Judges face said it all :) But it did work.

I knw that all this happened a long time ago and times have changed, but my views have remained constant. These scrotes choose to play by their rules so they have no grounds to complain when those rules backfire, after all nobody forces them to do what they do.

So, if they get hurt then good karma and poetic justice apply.

When it comes to ordinary motorists and bikers, they have nothing to fear. To go down the route of making contact it has to be a last resort, and the footage has shown that it is a large resort.

Sorry if that sounds harsh, maybe its because I was raised and served in a different era.
 
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Pete/48

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#13
I agree with this tactic , it should have been used as soon as the problem became apparent .

If you choose not to stop then this might happen I suppose . So the answer is surely just to stop when you see police behind you who obviously want you to stop for them .
:applaudit::applaudit::applaudit::applaudit: EXACTLY RIGHT:applaudit::applaudit::applaudit::applaudit:,
 

FTM

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#14
I remember an incident similar to the one with the 14 year olds you describe TC. IIRC the controversy was because the HGV was parked over the brow of a hill so the drivers had no chance to stop from 110mph. Maybe it was the same incident, I don't recall how old the driver was.
 

TC1474

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#15
I remember an incident similar to the one with the 14 year olds you describe TC. IIRC the controversy was because the HGV was parked over the brow of a hill so the drivers had no chance to stop from 110mph. Maybe it was the same incident, I don't recall how old the driver was.
No, there was no hill brow, this was a straight piece of road with a very slight incline off ramp on the M4 at junction 11 and the HGV was clearly visible.

But back in the late 70's and early 80's there were a number of similar types of incidents
 

FTM

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#16
Having seen my mates beaten up by the police for questioning why they were tripping them up as they walked down a street, I have no faith in the police being good men and true. The sergeant who instigated the beating had 3 or 4 days earlier beaten to death (justifiable homicide) Liddle Towers, which he got off with!
I also had a brother of a friend die while being chased by police around the country lanes of north Yorkshire. He was a wrong-un who used to get the police to chase him so his mates could listen in on the police frequency radio channel for a laugh. Apparantly the police were right up his arse and witnessed the crash but at the inquest the nearest car was said to be half a mile from the crash! Maybe they hit him, maybe they didn't. I just don't trust them to not be tempted to just give a bike a nudge to stop it being ridden off.
 

FTM

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#17
No, there was no hill brow, this was a straight piece of road with a very slight incline off ramp on the M4 at junction 11 and the HGV was clearly visible.

But back in the late 70's and early 80's there were a number of similar types of incidents
And of course the papers like a good story, I'm afraid I trust the reporters even less than the police.
I may have trust issues :).
 

petey2sheds

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#18
I expect the majority of us on the forum may have trust issues due to being a bunch of crotchety old farts :shot:, however, I too think the 33% quote to be over blown & would like to see how those apparently in the know have arrived at this figure,:nusenuse: , the fact that this tactic seems to be having some impact on these idiots can only be a good thing, & I agree with TC that your ordinary biker going about his business is unlikely to fall foul of this course of action. I would imagine current plod will not be making these decisions lightly.
I can see it affecting scoot joyriders, but as some have pointed out, joyriders cannot be approached rationally & have no regard for anyone but themselves.
 

Pete/48

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#19
These scrotes choose to play by their rules so they have no grounds to complain when those rules backfire, after all nobody forces them to do what they do.

So, if they get hurt then good karma and poetic justice apply.

When it comes to ordinary motorists and bikers, they have nothing to fear. To go down the route of making contact it has to be a last resort, and the footage has shown that it is a large resort.

Sorry if that sounds harsh, maybe its because I was raised and served in a different era.
I couldn't agree more TC, :applaudit::applaudit::applaudit:,

As I see it, the one constant fact In every case that I have ever read or heard about is the fact the driver of the offending Scooter/Bike/Car all clearly knew they had been requested to stop by the police, and by not doing so and making a run for it, that's when that same driver had more or less said "up you mate" and in doing so it is he who is the one who has then thrown any "rights" he may have thought he was entitled to out of the window, And from that point onward's IT IS HE WHO MUST EXCEPT ALL RESPONSIBILITY THAT GOES WITH THE DECISION HE HAS MADE,

Well TC, I'm thinking you and I must have been raised with the same values in life, and so far, I've never had any regrets about that ;):)



 

TC1474

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#20
Back in the early 80's, there were a spate of crashes particularly involving Panda cars who got involved in pursuits.

Now bearing in mind that the training a Panda car driver got was very different to that of a Traffic crew not to mention the different equipment they had, namely low powered 1100cc petrol engines or diesels, it was not surprising.

So the instruction was given that no Police vehicle was to get involved in a pursuit (which also prohibited us traffic crews) and anyone who did would be subject to a disciplinary for disobedience to orders.

About 24 hours after this order came out, a pand car crew were parked up when a chap came running over and said that a guy had just entered their house, beaten the crap out of him and his wife and was making off in a car.

Crew had to say "Sorry, can't help you, we are banned from getting involved" .

So this then raised the question of whether a Policeman should ignore such incidents as the primary function was the protection of life and property, the apprehension and arrest of offenders, or so they get done for disobedience to orders.

Over the next 24 hours word got around and carnage ensued.

Lets just say that this order not to chase was resinced within about 48 hours, but the rules changed and it became ony traffic crews who could get involved which then asked the question, what happened at 2am when the nearest traffic car was 45 minutes away ar the far west end of the force area?

There are of course bad eggs in every barrel no matter what line of work they are in. There are bad Policemen, Firemen and Ambulance crews, Military, there are bad Bankers and insurance agents, Solicitors, Barristers and Judges, Doctors and Nurses, (I have issues with trust in respect of quite a few medical staff), but the majority in my experience start the day with doing the best they can with the tools they have but sometimes mistakes are made and accidents happen.

This statement does not of course include those who are fundemenatally dishonest as part of their character who use their position to abuse their criminal needs. They are also the scum of the earth in my humble opinion.

99% of us who have served have chosed to do so for the right reasons (I know I did). The minority though have tarred everyone with the same brush.
 
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